Interesting read, but I don't think this is how the Bible tells it. When Jesus died on the cross. He cried out, "Father, into your hands I commit my spirit." So Jesus spirit was with the Father in heaven, where all the saints of the Old Testament were. This is why he told the theif, "today you will be with me in paradise."
Three days later, when Jesus came back to life as it says 1 Peter 3:18-19 "he was put to death in the body, and then made alive in the spirit.." how do you make a spirit more alive? "...he descended to the spirits in prison and made proclamation.." In body and spirit, Jesus showed those in hell, from the days of Noah (those who rejected Noah's teaching in his day), that He did what He said He would do. If He went a s a spirit, He could do that whenever as the Father, but He is Jesus the Christ, Both God and Man.
The Ephesians 4:8 about taking captivity captive, that is sin, death and the devil, not human spirits, as they are already in heaven with the Father, Just like Lazarus. The rich man, was in hell, judged. The only part of waiting is when the body is reunited with the soul, and tonspend eternity in hell, just like the bodies of the saints will be reunited with their bodies when Jesus returns. Whe Jesus does return, I believe the saints may remain and the lost will be whisked away. Puts a different spin on "left behind".
As far as Saul and the witch of Endor. 1 or 2nd Corinthians says that Satan can appear as an angel of light. Thus it makes sense that the "spirit" of Samuel said "Saul and his son's would be with him" Saul was an unbeliever. Satan is a liar and a deceiver, he told Saul what Saul wanted to hear.
If all this about Sheol is true, and spirits in Sheol are comfortable or not. How do you explain Elijah and Enoch? When Jesus was on the mount and Moses and Elijah appeared, these are contradictions according to our reasoning. Moses died before seeing the promised lands, and Elijah was taken up into heaven in a chariot and fiery horses. Yet, when the meeting with Jesus, Elijah in body and Moses in spirit. At the same time, if there is a hell, but a holding place for the righteous, how could our God be so careless to have a place for the lost, but not for the saved? How hard is it for God to make a place in heaven for spirits, especially when He knows the end game? I know a bunch of questions we can't answer, but perhaps that isn't where the focus should be aimed. Jesus, born, His life and message, death on a cross for the forgiveness of our sins, and resurrection from death, as the first fruits, and Ascended to the Father, but not apart from us as many assume. But with us as He promised, to the end of the age. This is the loving God we have. We sinned, He saves us from our sin and one days we will be with Him.
Great question. So generally, we use the greek word Gehenna for the 'lake of fire' at the end of time and hades (or Sheol in the Old Testament) for the cave/prison as a place of waiting. In Revelation, God throws death and hades in the Lake of fire. *When it comes to the word 'hell,' it comes from the German language for the underworld and its imagery is closer to Hades and Sheol. In modern English however, it has heavily been influenced by Protestantism and late Western models where the fire is already present and the intermediate state of Hades is less emphasized. Orthodoxy never made this shift and kept the distinctions between these two states. Currently, people have a foretaste of what is to come, but will not have the fullness of judgement until Christ comes again. I hope this helps!
Thank you so much Kyle! I really appreciate you taking time out of your day to respond to my comment. Love your YouTube talks and your gracious spirit towards Protestants and Catholics :) (I'm a convert to Orthodoxy). May God richly bless you and your family.
very well explained!
Thank you! I enjoy the topic
Interesting read, but I don't think this is how the Bible tells it. When Jesus died on the cross. He cried out, "Father, into your hands I commit my spirit." So Jesus spirit was with the Father in heaven, where all the saints of the Old Testament were. This is why he told the theif, "today you will be with me in paradise."
Three days later, when Jesus came back to life as it says 1 Peter 3:18-19 "he was put to death in the body, and then made alive in the spirit.." how do you make a spirit more alive? "...he descended to the spirits in prison and made proclamation.." In body and spirit, Jesus showed those in hell, from the days of Noah (those who rejected Noah's teaching in his day), that He did what He said He would do. If He went a s a spirit, He could do that whenever as the Father, but He is Jesus the Christ, Both God and Man.
The Ephesians 4:8 about taking captivity captive, that is sin, death and the devil, not human spirits, as they are already in heaven with the Father, Just like Lazarus. The rich man, was in hell, judged. The only part of waiting is when the body is reunited with the soul, and tonspend eternity in hell, just like the bodies of the saints will be reunited with their bodies when Jesus returns. Whe Jesus does return, I believe the saints may remain and the lost will be whisked away. Puts a different spin on "left behind".
As far as Saul and the witch of Endor. 1 or 2nd Corinthians says that Satan can appear as an angel of light. Thus it makes sense that the "spirit" of Samuel said "Saul and his son's would be with him" Saul was an unbeliever. Satan is a liar and a deceiver, he told Saul what Saul wanted to hear.
If all this about Sheol is true, and spirits in Sheol are comfortable or not. How do you explain Elijah and Enoch? When Jesus was on the mount and Moses and Elijah appeared, these are contradictions according to our reasoning. Moses died before seeing the promised lands, and Elijah was taken up into heaven in a chariot and fiery horses. Yet, when the meeting with Jesus, Elijah in body and Moses in spirit. At the same time, if there is a hell, but a holding place for the righteous, how could our God be so careless to have a place for the lost, but not for the saved? How hard is it for God to make a place in heaven for spirits, especially when He knows the end game? I know a bunch of questions we can't answer, but perhaps that isn't where the focus should be aimed. Jesus, born, His life and message, death on a cross for the forgiveness of our sins, and resurrection from death, as the first fruits, and Ascended to the Father, but not apart from us as many assume. But with us as He promised, to the end of the age. This is the loving God we have. We sinned, He saves us from our sin and one days we will be with Him.
Aren't Hell and Hades different? If Jesus destroyed Hell that would imply the heresy of Universalism.
Great question. So generally, we use the greek word Gehenna for the 'lake of fire' at the end of time and hades (or Sheol in the Old Testament) for the cave/prison as a place of waiting. In Revelation, God throws death and hades in the Lake of fire. *When it comes to the word 'hell,' it comes from the German language for the underworld and its imagery is closer to Hades and Sheol. In modern English however, it has heavily been influenced by Protestantism and late Western models where the fire is already present and the intermediate state of Hades is less emphasized. Orthodoxy never made this shift and kept the distinctions between these two states. Currently, people have a foretaste of what is to come, but will not have the fullness of judgement until Christ comes again. I hope this helps!
Thank you so much Kyle! I really appreciate you taking time out of your day to respond to my comment. Love your YouTube talks and your gracious spirit towards Protestants and Catholics :) (I'm a convert to Orthodoxy). May God richly bless you and your family.